What is this on my ornamental orange?

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Amateur

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What is this on my ornamental orange?
« on: August 08, 2012, 08:47:32 PM »
Hi, I was given, as a gift, a young, healthy looking Citrus reticulata ornamentale. Its in a large pot in a partly protected west facing porch outside the front door. I stupidly didn't water it nearly two weeks ago as heavy rain was predicted overnight, which never arrived. (there was flooding in the Gers, just south of here :() By the time I looked at it the next day two thirds of the leaves were dead. I got them off & the rest is thriving - plenty of new leaves & I can see the oranges growing. But a sort of browney orange mottled substance has appeared at the base of the main branches where they join the stem. It looks almost like drops of something secreted by the tree, but its rock solid. Does anyone know what it is?
I'm quite worried, not only because I don't want to lose this tree, but the same people who gave me it gave me a Lemon tree last year which turned out to have mealy bug on it!
« Last Edit: August 18, 2012, 02:17:24 PM by Amateur »
We have 5.000 sq metres of flat garden facing E-W with a pool near the middle. We have had a wall 1m50 high built 3/4 of the way around it to protect it from the strong winds that blow across the fields behind & to the the right - N-W. I need advice on planting inside & outside to finish & decorate.

David Bracey

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2012, 03:26:01 PM »
Please post a pic if possible David
MGS member.

 I have gardened in sub-tropical Florida, maritime UK, continental Europe and the Mediterranean basin, France. Of the 4 I have found that the most difficult climate for gardening is the latter.

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MikeHardman

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2012, 09:28:56 PM »
Sounds like citrus gumnosis.
There are plenty of refs, eg.
http://www1.ju.edu.jo/ecourse/Plant%20Protection/Material/GUMMOSIS%20OF%20CITRUS%20TREESm.htm
We'll await the photo(s).
If it is that, I hope it is just in response to stress/damage and not Phytophthora.
Mike
Geologist by Uni training, IT consultant, Referee for Viola for Botanical Society of the British Isles, commissioned author and photographer on Viola for RHS (Enc. of Perennials, The Garden, The Plantsman).
I garden near Polis, Cyprus, 100m alt., on marl, but have gardened mainly in S.England

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John

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2012, 10:19:10 PM »
Mike, it sounds like something you would make up!
John
Horticulturist, photographer, author, garden designer and plant breeder; MGS member and RHS committee member. I garden at home in SW London and also at work in South London.

Amateur

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2012, 02:02:34 PM »
I've tried to post a photo, but after choosing it, the number appears beside the browse button & nothing else happens. I don't know what to do next. I never have any problems posting photos on hotmail or facebook - can you help please? :( :-[
We have 5.000 sq metres of flat garden facing E-W with a pool near the middle. We have had a wall 1m50 high built 3/4 of the way around it to protect it from the strong winds that blow across the fields behind & to the the right - N-W. I need advice on planting inside & outside to finish & decorate.

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Alisdair

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2012, 03:12:38 PM »
I'm sorry you're having trouble trying to post that photo, Amateur. You might find the answer you need if you click here, and there are several other photo-guidance threads in the main How The Forum Works section.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2012, 03:14:16 PM by Alisdair »
Alisdair Aird
Gardens in SE England (Sussex); also coastal Southern Greece, and (in a very small way) South West France; MGS member (and former president); vice chairman RHS Lily Group, past chairman Cyclamen Society

Amateur

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2012, 02:19:49 PM »
Hooray! I have at last figured out how to make the number of pixels smaller & have added two photos of my poor orange tree to my original post.  i hope this helps. thanks for being patient! :)
We have 5.000 sq metres of flat garden facing E-W with a pool near the middle. We have had a wall 1m50 high built 3/4 of the way around it to protect it from the strong winds that blow across the fields behind & to the the right - N-W. I need advice on planting inside & outside to finish & decorate.

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MikeHardman

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2012, 06:24:56 AM »
Amateur,

Thanks for the photos, but I can't see the gummy bits very well. However, I get the idea they may be by wounds. The wounds themselves may be the cause. I see this on my almond tree where the rats have stripped the bark in patches. If the gummy bits are the result of physically-inflicted wounds, I think there is nothing to worry about (so long as the wounds heal-over in due course).
But suitable wounds can due to canker or other problems (at least on apples, pears, Prunus...): that would be more of a worry. Worst case scenario: your plant has Phytophthora citrophthora, of which the gummosis is a symptom.

However, it seems that the defoliated parts of your tree are sprouting new shoots/leaves, which is a good sign. That leads me to a general feeling that your tree will be OK.

IMO; other folks please feel free to provide a different view!

Refs:
- gummosis in general, including good photo of gummosis on Prunus
- gummosis of citrus
- photo of gummosis on lemon
Mike
Geologist by Uni training, IT consultant, Referee for Viola for Botanical Society of the British Isles, commissioned author and photographer on Viola for RHS (Enc. of Perennials, The Garden, The Plantsman).
I garden near Polis, Cyprus, 100m alt., on marl, but have gardened mainly in S.England

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Alisdair

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2012, 07:15:25 AM »
I agree with Mike, I wouldn't panic about this. I doubt whether there are so many citrus trees around you that the specialised phytophthora is at all likely in your area. Even in areas where citrus abound, as around our Greek garden, it's not at all common, and we've never had any problem with it ourselves although we do get wind damage, producing that sort of wound.
It's always too easy to be alarmed at the possibilities once you start trawling around on the internet. Much better to rely on people's actual experience (which is really what this forum is aimed to provide).
Alisdair Aird
Gardens in SE England (Sussex); also coastal Southern Greece, and (in a very small way) South West France; MGS member (and former president); vice chairman RHS Lily Group, past chairman Cyclamen Society

David Bracey

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2012, 10:07:01 AM »
I see that your orange is indoor.  Get it outside for some light and photosynthesis.  We used to store "citrus" in the sous-sol and bring them out after the winter.  They invariably lost all their leaves, much like your trees but recovered marvellously.  It looks as though your trees are well on the mend.
MGS member.

 I have gardened in sub-tropical Florida, maritime UK, continental Europe and the Mediterranean basin, France. Of the 4 I have found that the most difficult climate for gardening is the latter.

Amateur

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2012, 03:45:49 PM »
Thanks very much for all your help - I'm fairly certain it is gummosis caused by drying out after a very hot & quite windy day & not being watered till midday the next day. It is outside the front door & gets full sun for 3/4 of the day.
 It is filling out with new leaves quite well & although some of the oranges have fallen off, this may be a symptom of the same episode, I think. Incidentally, the Lemon that had mealy bug & we thought was dead - a new leaf grew on the trunk, so my husband cut the top off & there are now a group of leaves which are growing rapidly everyday. Hopefully, I may have it back after all - although it will be a while before I have any Lemons to pick!  :)
We have 5.000 sq metres of flat garden facing E-W with a pool near the middle. We have had a wall 1m50 high built 3/4 of the way around it to protect it from the strong winds that blow across the fields behind & to the the right - N-W. I need advice on planting inside & outside to finish & decorate.

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MikeHardman

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2012, 05:14:11 PM »
With outdoor pots, big and small, I like to nest one inside another, especially if the pot itself gets direct sunshine. That allows the outer pot to keep the inner one in the shade, hence cooler. And I think coolness is important - as soil in a sunned pot can get hot, and if it has been watered, you can end up cooking the roots (which like to gather next to the side of the pot). Using the pot-in-pot technique also allows you to plant in a cheap pot, and use an expensive decorative pot outside - without fear that in future you might risk breaking the expensive one at repotting time (especially if the pot is not wedge-shaped). If the inner pot is pottery, it can still breathe.
Mike
Geologist by Uni training, IT consultant, Referee for Viola for Botanical Society of the British Isles, commissioned author and photographer on Viola for RHS (Enc. of Perennials, The Garden, The Plantsman).
I garden near Polis, Cyprus, 100m alt., on marl, but have gardened mainly in S.England

Umbrian

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2012, 06:41:52 AM »
Very interesting Mike and gives you the opportunity to put the outer pots into a protected environment during winter months when, if like me, the danger of frost can damage them.
MGS member living and gardening in Umbria, Italy for past 19 years. Recently moved from my original house and now planning and planting a new small garden.

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MikeHardman

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Re: What is this on my ornamental orange?
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2012, 07:49:34 AM »
Yup - that's true, too - good point
Mike
Geologist by Uni training, IT consultant, Referee for Viola for Botanical Society of the British Isles, commissioned author and photographer on Viola for RHS (Enc. of Perennials, The Garden, The Plantsman).
I garden near Polis, Cyprus, 100m alt., on marl, but have gardened mainly in S.England