identification of this Salvia

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Charithea

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identification of this Salvia
« on: April 18, 2020, 03:49:34 PM »
I have been trying to identify the Salvia below by checking all the names in the Mediterranean Seed Bank and checked all Salvias in Yiannis Gryllis list and internet photos.. The nearest I got to is Salvia disermas 'Pink'. I am not sure if it is correct. Please help! It is a rather untidy and loose plant and flops everywhere, the flowers are not spectacular BUT the rough leaves when touched give out the most amazing citrus smell. I apologise for the quality of the photos but I used the ipad. My camera and my old computer don't get along.
I garden in Cyprus, in a flat old farming field, alt. approx. 30 m asl.

David Dickinson

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2020, 05:16:26 PM »
Hi Charithea

Is this a young plant or is it fully grown? I ask because a couple of years ago you gave me some seeds of S desoleana which, in the books,  looks a bigger plant. Mine never germinated so I can't compare what you have photographed. Most internet entries refer to pale pink flowers with a white lower lip and exceptionally fragrant leaves. B Clebsch too in "The New Book of Salvias".  J Whittlesey in his book "The Plant Lover's Guide to Salvias" makes no reference to the aromatic leaves and says the flowers are white.

Wikipedia says S. disermas' leaves smell of hay

Just an idea. Hope you find the answer.
I have a small garden in Rome, Italy. Some open soil, some concrete, some paved. Temperatures in winter occasionally down to 0C. Summer temperatures up to 40C in the shade. There are never watering restrictions but, of course, there is little natural water for much of June, July and August.

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Charithea

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2020, 05:05:09 AM »
Thank you David for your ideas. We have aSalvia desoleana and it grew from seeds from the Med. Seed bank that I put down 2 years ago. The leaves do smell like hay. The Salvia that I photographed came as a small plant from Yiannis Gryllis last autumn. I had ordered some Salvias by phone and after the AGM in Athens he brought me a box  full of young plants. He was very busy so I did not get the names at that time.  Among those plants there were 4 Salvia Allen Chickeringwhich have started to bloom and a Salvia candelabra that is showing signs of blooming.
I garden in Cyprus, in a flat old farming field, alt. approx. 30 m asl.

David Dickinson

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2020, 09:53:37 AM »
Hi

According to the "books" it is S  disermas that should smell like hay.  But I don't have either S disermas or S desoleana so I can't say from experience.

I have had experience of S clevlandii 'Allen Chickering' and S clevelandii . I am now onto my 3rd year and 3rd plant.  :( The first 2 I kept in a pot and gave in to the temptation to water them over the summer. Fatal! I had read that summer watering was not the thing to do but seeing the poor things seemingly dying anyway I gave them a little water.

This year I dug up my S 'Anthony Parker' to make room for S 'Allen Chickering'. I wish I could have done it in autumn but that was when the S 'Anthony Parker' was in full flower. Of course, fate played a trick on me. Once I put the S 'Allen Chickering' into the ground , a colony of ants decided to build their nest in the root ball! Let's hope for the best. S 'Anthony Parker' is very happy in his new large pot, by the way.

This site recommends some wartering over the summer. I am going to try without this year.

https://inlandvalleygardenplanner.org/plants/salvia-allen-chickering/

Both S clevelandii and the hybrid S 'Allen Chickering' have beautifully fragrant foliage. But I found the S clevelandii filled the garden with perfume whereas S 'Allen Chickering"  needs to be rubbed to release the scent.


I have a small garden in Rome, Italy. Some open soil, some concrete, some paved. Temperatures in winter occasionally down to 0C. Summer temperatures up to 40C in the shade. There are never watering restrictions but, of course, there is little natural water for much of June, July and August.

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Charithea

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2020, 11:12:42 AM »
Thank you David once again for being such a Star. I have 2 Salvia clevelandii both given to me by Yiannos Orphanos. They like the sun and do survive without water in the summer. TheAllen Chickering need to be cut back just like it says in the video. They are leggy so I shall prune them. I can send you some seeds of Salvia desoliana and disermas if of course it turns out to be one, when the seeds are ready. The Athony Parker is very comfortable in our garden. I have started planting cuttings on the edge of the garden that is adjacent to the road this spring.On the inner wall I have transplanted the Salvia hierosolymitana that I could not give to friends. When John finishes extending my Salvia area I shall separate  the new seedling from the Diomides Botanic Garden. So far so good with the isolation.
I garden in Cyprus, in a flat old farming field, alt. approx. 30 m asl.

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John J

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2020, 02:15:44 PM »
The extending of her salvia areas that Thea mentions is part of my 'find something to do in the lockdown' projects, that includes rejigging some of the paths in the garden. Not only does it help to pass the time but it is good exercise, or so I keep telling my aching back and sore knees!!  :(
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)

David Dickinson

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2020, 09:16:05 PM »
Hi
I got my wires crossed in my first reply. I do have Salvia desoleana, from seed that you kindly gave me. It was the S hierosolymitana seeds that you gave me which didn't germinate. I will check the scent of the leaves tomorrow morning and report back. :)
I have a small garden in Rome, Italy. Some open soil, some concrete, some paved. Temperatures in winter occasionally down to 0C. Summer temperatures up to 40C in the shade. There are never watering restrictions but, of course, there is little natural water for much of June, July and August.

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Charithea

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2020, 04:49:06 AM »
I  have reread the information regarding my unknown Salvia and  Ioannis Gryllis identified it last night as  Salvia disermas Pink.  I just did the smell test. Both Salvia desoleana and disermas have a similar odour to start with but after rubbing both vigorously the 'disermas' gives out the lemonibergamont aroma.  I noticed that 'desoleana' has big rough leaves and grows upright and 'disermas'  very much smaller leaves and extremely untidy branches. I have send some seeds to you David D.
I garden in Cyprus, in a flat old farming field, alt. approx. 30 m asl.

David Dickinson

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Re: identification of this Salvia
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2020, 08:46:16 AM »
I'll look forward to receiving them. Thanks a lot :-) Just one snag - the Italian postal system. I don't want to be unkind to my host country which has many wonderful things to offer. Its postal system is not one of them, however!

Cheers  :)
I have a small garden in Rome, Italy. Some open soil, some concrete, some paved. Temperatures in winter occasionally down to 0C. Summer temperatures up to 40C in the shade. There are never watering restrictions but, of course, there is little natural water for much of June, July and August.