The MGS Forum
Plants for mediterranean gardens => Trees and Shrubs => Topic started by: John J on August 07, 2011, 09:41:07 AM
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The tree in the photos is the only one that I have seen in Cyprus. I believe I know what it is but would like to hear other members opinions to see if they agree. The photos were taken in July.
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Lovely tree, John.
I guess it is Cassia fistula, but I don't have any first-hand experience to go on.
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This time we are in agreement, Mike, as that was what I thought it was too. I also agree that it is a beautiful tree, a pity it isn't mine but is in a garden in Souni village.
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Lovely to see, John. I'd have thought it would need quite a lot of water, coming from tropical India, and more popular in places like Florida than the Mediterranean?
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Alasdair, Re water requirements:
I would tend to agree in principle, but I note from the Wiki entry:
"It will grow well in dry climates. Growth for this tree is best in full sun on well-drained soil; it is relatively drought tolerant and slightly salt tolerant."
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cassia_fistula (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cassia_fistula))
Also, at least one other member of the genus is drought tolerant: C. nemophila. In Cyprus, this grows unirrigated by roadsides, in motorway central reservations, and in a few gardens.
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With regard to the water requirements of this particular tree, I noticed when I stopped the car to take the photos that it was on an irrigation line, however I have no way of knowing how much or how often it is getting water. As Mike says Senna artemisioides (or suspecies thereof) are quite common in Cyprus and thrive without summer water. I have 2 that get virtually no water other than the winter rain.
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Looking at the photographs that's definitely C. fistula. From personal experience in Australia I can confirm that C. fistula will withstand very hot climates, if it gets some supplementary water during summer. It does not require enormous amounts of water - I'd say on par with citrus trees.
It is very sensitive to frost however and needs a sheltered spot. I have seen it growing well in Port Augusta, an inland town in South Australia where summer temperatures can stay above 40C for 10 or more days, while winter temperatures could drop below 2C. Initially our neighbour had a single tree that she grew from seed collected in the sub-tropics but my mother grew dozens of others from seed, selling them at school fetes etc and soon there were many growing in the town. The spring flowering was truly spectacular I remember standing under that first tree as a child and the whole world seemed to turn bright daffodil yellow as the sun filtered through the blooms. The leaves are rather attractive too retaining a lovely fresh green color. The trees in Port Augusta however seldom grew more than 3-4 metres high while those I have seen in the sub-tropics around Cairns and Darwin in Australia are more than 10m high. Cheers Anita
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A big welcome from us all to Anita, another new forum member from Australia. It's really great to have this extra Australian perspective on mediterranean-climate gardening :) :)
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Desmond Meikle, in his 'Flora of Cyprus' includes many introduced ornamentals, among which is Cassia fistula, to which he gives the common name Indian pudding-pipe tree, and describes it as growing to 10m or more.
He also mentions, in Cassia:
- C. artemisioides (which The Plant List (http://www.theplantlist.org) regards as separate from C. nemophila, which I have referred to previously in this topic)
- C. didymobotrya
- C. senna (as in senna pods)
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I assume this is the same shrub that I have in "The Flowers of Crete" but thought I'd get everyone to have a look at this. This was planted en-mass by the main highway on the north coast of central Crete. I have it as Senna corymbosa (syn. Cassia corymbosa) from Argentina and Uruguay. It was planted in a very open spot which was baking hot though they were possibly irrigated! I'm not sure now.
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John, your plant is Senna corymbosa (syn Cassia corymbosa) and I would assume that it must be irrigated as mine looks decidedly sorry for itself if deprived of water for any length of time. Unlike Senna artemisioides (syn Cassia artemisioides) that will take being left without water for very long periods.
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Yes I'm sure they were irrigated now I think of it. Quite crazy irrigating planting along such a long road especially as it comes at the cost of losing the very limited moist habitats on Crete. The planting looks really out of place anyway. It would be more appropriate to restrict ornamental plantings near to urban habitats and obviously with drought tolerant plants.
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A lot of the 'road improvements' that have taken place in Limassol (Lemesos) recently have been totally inappropriate. Central reservations and roadside verges planted with grass, roundabout islands with plants that need irrigation, trees planted under flyovers (even the approach ramps so that they have little or no headroom to start with). Irrigation is either by sprinkler system, sometimes pop-up, or by hoses from water bowsers. The standard excuse is that it is 'recycled' water so what else can be done with it?!!
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This is a plant ID posting, but I'm sure it is a Cassia, and we already have a good bit of momentum on that genus here - so I'm posting it here rather than in the 'plant identification' topic.
It forms a large shrub, up to 2.5m tall in the garden of the friend who gave me this one. It is in good flower now; the photos were taken today. No scent that I can detect. The leaves have 6 leaflets and spend most of their time folded flat, as shown in some of the photos.
ID please!
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Are you sure that isn't a Senna corymbosa you have there, Mike? They have 6-8 leaflets and they do tend to fold flat, especially if they are water stressed.
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Thanks John.
You could be right.
When I looked at JohnF's photos I discounted mine being the same species because the leaves are narrower on mine, and when I looked at some other photos, I saw the same thing. Also, Wikipedia had the height of S. corymbosa as up to 1m - much smaller than mine.
But looking at more examples, I find ones with leaves as narrow as mine, and mentions of height up to 3m.
The flowers are certainly a good match for JohnF's.
So I'm happy to go with S. corymbosa.
Thanks both.
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Another Senna (Cassia) needing the application of some great minds!...
I think this is Senna artemisioides; what does the team think?...
And if so, which subspecies - there are quite a few...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senna_artemisioides (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senna_artemisioides)
(poor photo, it was a quick snap in the garden centre)
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Mike
It is Senna artemisoides subsp. sturtii.
A very drought resistent, no need to water it after the second seoson.
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Thank you Oron
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I realize that nothing has been posted on this topic for a few years. Since my initial posting we have acquired 2 Cassia fistula trees, both still very small. Both seem to be displaying slightly strange behavior. The smaller of the two has shed last year's leaves and has begun recently to open new ones, while the other has hung on to its old leaves and is showing no inclination to produce new ones.
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Not re Cassia, but re Brachychiton and perhaps of relevance ...
I have four B. populneus in a short row, ostensibly the same soil, situation, watering, etc.
They were all grown from seed collected at the same time from below street trees in Paphos, sown at the same time, planted at the same time.
One of them always produces its new flush of leaves later than the other three (which are pretty much in sync). I attribute this to chance minor variation in the species, and that pertains whether or not the seeds call came from the same particular street tree or not.
I see no reason why similar variation should not occur in Cassia or other trees.
But I can imagine environmantal factors could also produce similar results.
Mike
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Further to my post of 2011...
I collected and grew more seed of Senna corymbosa (I presume), from a different parent plant.
It germinated well. I planted out the saplings at the start of the year, and despite regular watering it seemed to make only a little growth. But it remained healthy, and this month It has flowered for the first time.
It is really very pleasing: lovely large bright yellow flowers in abundance, persisting well despite some storms. And they seem to be pest-free. Love em!
Mike
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Update re my Senna corymbosa...
My plants flowered for 2 or 3 months; there are still a few flowers now. Very pleasing.
Seed pods are now well developed, though still green (see photo).
I have read that this species can become invasive, so I plan to collect all the seed pods before they shed seed. Am I being overly cautious? Perhaps invasiveness would be curtailed by our long hot summers without irrigation?
Also, I have a more tree-like Senna, which grew from seed. Although it produces seed every year, and I do nothing to harvest it, it has not given rise to a single self-sown seedling in the six years since I planted it out.
Maybe that answers my question...
//Mike
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I started this thread off with a photo of a Cassia fistula in full bloom, not mine but in a garden we were passing one day. Later we acquired 2 small trees of our own and have been patiently (well, sort of) waiting for one or other of them to flower. One of them has and flower is the right word as it produced a single bloom!
It may be the Golden Shower tree but all ours managed was one drop. :(
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Well, it is a nice flower, John. I hope it is merely a hint of a taste of things to come. It may be precocious; the main flowering may be later this summer.