The MGS Forum
Plants for mediterranean gardens => Bulbs (including other geophytes with corms, tubers, rhizomes etc) => Topic started by: John on July 16, 2011, 10:19:42 AM
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Muscari macrocarpum is a species which has fleshy large roots that are functional until the next growing season. They are also contractile which occurs in certain other bulbous plants. It is possibly due to the eventual loss of moisture that the large roots effectively shrink. In the close up of the root to the left the contraction has caused the outer surface to concertina which will gradually pull the bulb down in the soil. This is also evident in the other roots but not so clear especially in such a small picture.
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I am new to planting Muscari and planted a number last autumn Muscari macrocarpum is in full bloom with lots of young flowers in the pipeline but the M.armeniacum has only leaves and no sign of flowers. Is this what I should expect??
Our Leopoldia comosa which we have had for a few years does appear much later.
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Yes I would say that Muscari macrocarpum is quite an early plant. It is in full flower in our greenhouse though I have to say I haven't checked if it is flowering outside at work. It has grown successfully on the rockery outside for quite a number of years now and has flowered every year.
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Pamela, so as to keep it easy for people to find topics, I've merged your muscari blooming question with the earlier thread where John was drawing attention to M. macrocarpum's contractile roots.
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Alisdair ....by merging I think it has got lost.
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Well, we'll see. We are trying to keep the main plant topics together so that for instance everything to do with Muscari sits in a single place.
If no-one adds anything to John's comment, we can try again later, perhaps under cultivation.
By the way, a point for everyone; when you add a message to an existing topic, the Subject comes up by default with the topic's main heading, but it's easy to change it to your own heading if you want - as I've changed this message from "Muscari and relatives" to "Muscari blooming". Always worth thinking about!
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"Muscari, Leopoldia, Bellevalia, Hyacinthella, etc."
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I would think in the long term it would be better just to list plants in their own genera. Lumping this lot could get quite large.
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Someone mentioned them as "the blue dwarves"
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I would think that that isn't PC.
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In the UK some people call all that lot "little blue jobs". We'll keep them together for the time being, then if it does get too congested, I'll split them into genera as you suggest, John.
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In this thread, Alberto asked John such an interesting and rewarding question about how deep he finds bulbs and corms etc growing in the wild that I think it's best to split it off as a separate topic, which you can find by clicking here (http://www.mgsforum.org/smf/index.php?topic=668.0).
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A small group of Muscari armeniacum. A scented harbinger of spring for me, always look forward to giving the first Muscari a good old sniff !
Martin
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Gorgeous, Martin!
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Oron, could you put a name to this little Muscari I found in the garden this morning with no label. Probably one I have grown from seed and forgotten about.
cheers
Michael.
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Wild guesses: M. armeniacum Do you know where the seed was from if, in fact, it was seed raised?
M. botryoides Album? M. argaeum - my spelling could be wrong? Over to Oron I think.
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Michael, i would think as Trevor suggested to be a white form of Muscari armeniacum.
Trevor, M. argaeum is now Muscari armeniacum 'Argei White' but i do not think it is this one as there is a hint of blue color on some of Michael's flowers.
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Thanks folks, I will go with armeniacum then. I have no idea where it came from.
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A close up of the flower head of the autumn flowering Muscari parviflorum,
cheers
fermi
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Muscari inconstrictum grown from seed sown in 2009 from two sources.
The larger one flowered for the first time last year and the seed came from the AGS Seedex,
the smaller two came from Kurt Vickery and flowered for the first time this year,
cheers
fermi
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I love the subtle colouring on Muscari muscarima.
This is one I bought from Marcus Harvey at Hillview Rare Plants in Tasmania a few years ago which has stayed a singleton, but I'm hoping that some seed raised ones will flower soon (and be true to name!)
cheers
fermi
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This little muscari was grown from seed from 'Gul Delight' - a selection made by Rannweig Wallis in Wales,
cheers
fermi
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I got this one about 30 years ago as "Muscari cyanea violacea" - Oron has identified it as a form of Muscari armeniacum,
cheers
fermi
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I grew this from SRGC Seedex as Bellevalia ciliata, but it may be another similar one - maybe Oron could give his opinion?
cheers
fermi
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A couple of late ones:
The dark blue Muscari leucostomum and the violet/cream/brown Muscari (Leopoldia) weissii
cheers
fermi
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1.Muscari parviflorum in flower now - those are some stockplants from Jim Archibald.
2.Muscari spec. - I took the picture this spring in northern Iran (Azerbayjan) - it was a very compact plant growing between rocks. Next to the rocky areas were cultivated fields where much higher and much darker Muscari with shorter flowerheads grew - ( M. neglectum?) - any ideas? perhaps M.a.v. szovitzianum?
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Hi Hans
Yes, i would say M. armeniacun [syn M. szovitsianum], while the dark form you describe may well be M. neglectum.
Here is one of which i took photos in Turkey, looks very similar.
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Wow, Hans, that form of Muscari armeniacum (szovitsianum) looks quite spectacular!
Oron, any suggestions about the Bellavalia ciliata I posted about?
... the violet/cream/brown Muscari (Leopoldia) weissii
cheers
fermi
Over a week later and the spikes have developed a bit more,
cheers
fermi
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I grew this from SRGC Seedex as Bellevalia ciliata, but it may be another similar one - maybe Oron could give his opinion?
cheers
fermi
Hi Fermi
Bellevalia is definatly the most difficult genus in terms of ID in particularly when plants are young as yours
In order to give an answer there is a need to see the pedicles at fruiting time.
The length and angle of these are an important feature to destingwish similar species.
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Hi Oron,
Thanks, I'll try to post some pics of the fruiting stems soon,
cheers
fermi
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In order to give an answer there is a need to see the pedicles at fruiting time.
The length and angle of these are an important feature to destingwish similar species.
Oron,
here's a couple of pics which may help,
cheers
fermi
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Fermi,
The two species I take in consideration are B. ciliata and B. longistyla, but as your plants are still juvenile, meaning less leaves and flowers and ciliate or smooth leaf margins.
I'm afraid that i can not give a definitive answer but i'm inclined towrds B. longistyla.
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Thanks, Oron,
I'll wait to see if they flower again next year and if there is any difference,
cheers
fermi
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Muscari
commutatum neglectum from seed from Goteborg 2010
cheers
fermi
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The Muscari inconstrictum I showed in 2014 is still going strong and flowering better this year,
cheers
fermi
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Fermi what a colour!!
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I think I got this as seed as Muscari azureum but it looks more like Pseudomuscari chalusicum
cheers
fermi
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The Muscari
commutatum neglectum shown last year is doing even better this year
cheers
fermi
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I've previously posted pics of this muscari as M. commutatum but I was corrected that it is in fact a form of Muscari neglectum - which explains why it is doing so well!
cheers
fermi
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Bellevalia paradoxa from seed from SRGC Seedex 2012
cheers
fermi
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I can't find the label for two muscari relatives in flower now (mid-spring).
Here is the first which I think is a bellevalia.
The little black bugs are red-legged earth-mites
cheers
fermi
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This one could be a leopoldia.
It is quite tall - over 20 cm
cheers
fermi
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Hi Fermi,
A bit difficult to decide from these photos but looks to me that you have two species from Crete, first, a recently described Bellevalia juliana and the other Muscari (Leopoldia) spreizenhoferi, tall form.
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Hi Oron,
thanks so much for the IDs.
Here's one which not everyone loves, the double 'Fantasy Creation'
cheers
fermi
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Hi Fermi,
A bit difficult to decide from these photos but looks to me that you have two species from Crete, first, a recently described Bellevalia juliana and the other Muscari (Leopoldia) spreizenhoferi, tall form.
The Leopoldia (Muscari) has lengthened and the "top knot" is now evident!
I have grown this species from seed before but I don't remember having planted a flowering sized one in this area! The stem is now over 60 cm in length (I can't say "tall" because it flops over!),
cheers
fermi
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My friend, Jon B, has grown this Leopoldia which he got as L. comosum, but doesn't think it is :o
Would anyone know what it actually is?
cheers
fermi
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We got this little grape hyacinth as Muscari mcbeathianum which it isn't!
I think it might be a form of Muscari muscarimi - pics taken a few days apart
cheers
fermi
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Fascinating colour changes!
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This pale blue muscari was a seedling which came up in another pot. It's possibly a seedling of Muscari 'Valerie Finnis'. Last year a pinkish coloured seedling flowered - probably from 'Gul' (sometimes called 'Gul Delight').
cheers
fermi
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Muscari sivrihisardaghlarensis.
I got seeds a few years ago but was very disappointed when the first flowers appeared 2 years ago to be just Muscari neglectum :(
Imagine my surprise when these bloomed and appear to be correct! Now I just need to separate them from the impostors!
cheers
fermi
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They look impressive Fermi. I am glad I did not have to type that long name.
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and what does it mean?
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and what does it mean?
Hi Hilary,
I believe Sivrihisar is a city or area in Anatolia, Turkey
cheers
fermi
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Pseudomuscari chalusicum from a couple of weeks ago
cheers
fermi
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Bellevalia macrobotrys grown from seed from Oron's Seeds of Peace
cheers
fermi