What is this? SOLVED

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John J

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What is this? SOLVED
« on: September 08, 2011, 10:05:22 AM »
I first encountered this plant at E A Bowles' Myddleton House many years ago. Several years later I acquired seeds and grew my own, I now have 2 here in Cyprus. Purely out of curiosity would anyone like to answer What is it?, though I doubt it will provide much of a challenge to our experts. Sorry about the rather tatty leaves.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2011, 07:02:00 PM by Alisdair »
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)

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John

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2011, 11:28:45 PM »
No one has had a go at this! But I am not surprised as I can't even think what family it is. Do you have it in flower for us to have a more educated guess please?
John
Horticulturist, photographer, author, garden designer and plant breeder; MGS member and RHS committee member. I garden at home in SW London and also at work in South London.

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John J

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2011, 05:45:34 AM »
John,
I'd forgotten about this as there were no responses. My first sighting at E A Bowles house suggests it is not a Mediterranean native. The fact that I only kept and grew on 2 of the seedlings may give some indication of size. Unfortunately I won't have any photos of flowers until those particular buds open in the spring when my Oriental aristocrat will be in it's full glory.
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)

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John

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2011, 10:17:25 AM »
Really guessing here. Is it in the Actinidiaceae?
John
Horticulturist, photographer, author, garden designer and plant breeder; MGS member and RHS committee member. I garden at home in SW London and also at work in South London.

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John J

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2011, 11:43:58 AM »
Sorry, no. Actually I should probably have planted one of these 5 months ago when my granddaughter was born. Apparently it was an old custom in its country of origin to do that on the birth of a baby girl.
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)

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John

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2011, 12:08:04 PM »
Oh dear. Does it produce an edible fruit?
John
Horticulturist, photographer, author, garden designer and plant breeder; MGS member and RHS committee member. I garden at home in SW London and also at work in South London.

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Alisdair

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2011, 01:03:16 PM »
You've been giving us some splendid clues, John, but I'm still in the dark!
Alisdair Aird
Gardens in SE England (Sussex); also coastal Southern Greece, and (in a very small way) South West France; MGS member (and former president); vice chairman RHS Lily Group, past chairman Cyclamen Society

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John J

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2011, 02:38:39 PM »
No edible fruit but winged seeds that disperse so widely that it has become an invasive weed in some places, eg Japan and parts of the US.
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)

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John

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2011, 02:53:39 PM »
OK it's a Paulownia. I can see it in the buds now but the leaves look too small! There are quite a few species but I assume that it's P. tomentosa?
John
Horticulturist, photographer, author, garden designer and plant breeder; MGS member and RHS committee member. I garden at home in SW London and also at work in South London.

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John J

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2011, 03:24:28 PM »
Spot on, John. The leaves around the flower buds are not typical and they have been seriously chewed up by something, probably grasshoppers. A view of the large leaves would have given it away. I don't know if it is usual but my tree produces flower buds in the summer and they stay dormant over the winter as the leaves drop and then open in the spring as the new leaves are beginning to appear.
The Oriental aristocrat refers to its common names of Empress tree and Princess tree.
Apparently the Chinese used to plant a Paulownia at the birth of a girl, with its fast growth habit they matured together and so by the time she was due to marry it could be cut down to provide wooden items for her dowry.
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)

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John

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2011, 04:42:32 PM »
Yes the buds form the previous year. They have become quite a common tree in London these days. I first grew one where I grew up in the Pennines where it was always cut back to ground level every winter and so could only be grown as a foliage plant. It wasn't until I moved to London that I saw them mature into flowering trees.
John
Horticulturist, photographer, author, garden designer and plant breeder; MGS member and RHS committee member. I garden at home in SW London and also at work in South London.

David Bracey

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Re: What is this?
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2011, 06:09:47 PM »
The large scalloped holes in the leaves are typical weevil damage, probably caused by the adult Black vine weevil, Otiorhynchus sulcatus.
MGS member.

 I have gardened in sub-tropical Florida, maritime UK, continental Europe and the Mediterranean basin, France. Of the 4 I have found that the most difficult climate for gardening is the latter.

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MikeHardman

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Re: What is this? SOLVED
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2011, 10:04:50 PM »
Call me picky, but I get the feeling those leaf chewings look more like lepidoptera caterpillar damage; it is not somehow as tatty as I might expect from weevils. Many caterpillars are nocturnal, of course, so you'd have to go out with a torch (and a handful of luck/patience) to check, John.

By way of an aside/parallel...
In geology, we have things called trace fossils (ichnofossils if you want to be jargonistic). These are fossils not of creatures themselves but of the traces they left behind; fossilized footprints are an example, though rare. Much more common are traces left by worms and shells as they move through sediment or across its surface. If you're very lucky you might find a real fossil at the end of a trace fossil - telling you for sure what made the trace fossil. In general, though, it is a good guessing game - identifying the creature from the trace it left behind.
One is often forced to play a similar game with modern-day creatures that leave evidence of their existence on or in plants. With evidence and observations from many observers over many years, we have come to recognize some of the creators of these signs, though usually with a degree of uncertainty. I have recently posted pictures of borings in stems of olive trees, which I attribute to leopard moth larvae. Tattered flower petals, one associates with earwigs. Particular shapes of chewed-out portions of leaves could indicate leaf-cutter bees. And so on. But sometimes we are just don't know. Fascination and wondrousness often have enigma, frustration and controversy as a companions!
« Last Edit: November 01, 2011, 10:15:37 PM by MikeHardman »
Mike
Geologist by Uni training, IT consultant, Referee for Viola for Botanical Society of the British Isles, commissioned author and photographer on Viola for RHS (Enc. of Perennials, The Garden, The Plantsman).
I garden near Polis, Cyprus, 100m alt., on marl, but have gardened mainly in S.England

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John J

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Re: What is this? SOLVED
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2012, 10:09:29 AM »
I realise that this topic has been solved and put to bed but the buds shown in the original photo have just begun to open. The current photo shows the first of them. It would appear to have a light fragrance but as the tree is in the midst of a group of citrus trees (orange, grapefruit, lemon) that are in full bloom their scent is so overwhelming that the poor old olfactory senses can't cope with anything more subtle.
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)

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John J

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Re: What is this? SOLVED
« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2019, 09:39:21 AM »
I realise that this thread has been dormant for some years but our tree is still going strong and flowering well.
Cyprus Branch Head. Gardens in a field 40 m above sea level with reasonably fertile clay soil.
"Aphrodite emerged from the sea and came ashore and at her feet all manner of plants sprang forth" John Deacon (13thC AD)