[Fleur Pavlidis]

Your jacaranda is lovely, Alisdair and indeed I took some seed from it to sow this autumn, but you have a very mild climate. Even the big jacaranda tree at  the MGS garden was killed right back to the roots in the cold winter of 2007. (We had a funeral for it and then it sprouted again.) My three little ones were burnt back to the ground then and one winter since and have never flowered. What are the winters like in your areas, Jorun?

[JTh]

It is probably somewhat colder here in Sithonia (Halkidiki) in the winter than in Athens, although there are few sites where I can find comparable information. In one place I saw that the mean temperatures for January and February are 5.5 and 6.8 respectively in one of the towns nearby, and the corresponding figures for Athens are 9.3 and 9.8. The jacaranda would be lovely here, but I can't remember having seen anything like that around here, maybe be because it is not hardy enough?

[Alisdair]

Down by our bit of coast in S Greece frost is very rare and fleeting. But they do have rather more frost in nearby Kalamata, where jacarandas flourish.
A few years ago we saw these jacarandas in full flower in Punakha, Bhutan. That has a more or less similar climate, with rare frosts in January (when the average temp goes down to a low of zero deg Celsius, 32 deg F). Although there are other jacaranda species, I'm sure these were the familiar Jacaranda mimosifolia (no other species is recorded in the Flora of Bhutan).

[JTh]

We do have frost here some winters, but not every year; our water pipes have been frozen as well a couple of times, though. It would be a perfect tree if it would survive the winter, I'll see if any of the local nurseries could give me any information.

[JTh]

I saw a couple of very nice loquats in the local market two days ago, and I was very tempted to buy one but decided to wait until September, since I will only be here for another 16 days now.

[Alisdair]

Jorun, Another fruit tree that gives useful shade and does well in mediterranean conditions is the persimmon, Diospyros kaki. The golden autumn fruits persist even after the leaves fall, glowing invitingly as the days cool. We had one just about surviving without watering, but it is only now (that it gets a weekly watering in summer) that it is growing well.
At the MGS meeting in Andalucia a few years ago some of us visited a carmen or private garden in Granada. This type of garden is very interesting, representing a unique style of gardening which in that particular town has a virtually unbroken tradition dating from Roman times. It is and was a pleasure garden, giving shade, coolness and fruit, and at the same time - very different from the more enclosed courtyard gardens that became the more usual style in Moorish times - always extended a view from this small civilised enclave over the less hospitable wider scenery beyond, thus emphasising the comfort of the garden itself.
This lovely private garden included this tempting table, in the shade of persimmon trees.

[Daisy]

Alisdair. Your photographs of the jacaranda and persimmon.

                                     WOW!!
 

Daisy

[JTh]

You are making it difficult for me now with another very good suggestion, Alisdair, I'll make a list of all the interesting options I have received here and see what I may find when the time is right.

[Janet Ibbotson]

Is there a named variety of non-fruiting Morus Alba to grow for shade and does anyone know a nursery in Greece which stocks it?

[MikeHardman]

Janet - have a read of this - http://ucanr.org/sites/UrbanHort/files/80182.pdf
I hope somebody can answer the nursery side of your question.

[anita]

Jorun, I've practical experience with both Melia and Jacaranda and agree that they are both lovely shade trees. However in the case of Melia I would not plant one adjacent to a path or an area that caries a lot of foot traffic as the seeds are shed freely in late winter and spring and as they are lovely, hard and round can pose a bit of a hazard as you can slip on them. City shires or councils in my home town of Adelaide are now planting a new selection which has fewer seeds because so many people complain about the hazard. (I don't I just sweep the path outside my home weekly). The jacaranda poses a similar issue.. they are gorgeous deciduous trees that grow well here - however again I would not plant one where there is a lot of foot traffic in summer, particularly if you know anyone who is allergic to bees. When in flower the trees shed their blossoms creating a beautiful lavender carpet - I really enjoy the color against the background of a green lawn - however even the fallen flowers attract bees and that can pose a problem for children or those with bee sting allergies. I don't know if you can get them in Greece but I'd suggest a Koelreuteria paniculata (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koelreuteria_paniculata) or elegans (both are decidous) if you could get them... or if you don't mind an evergreen, a Pepper tree Schinus molle ttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schinus_molle. The wikipedia entry says the tree grows massive but under restricted watering regimes it tends to top out at about five or six metres. Certainly in Adelaide's climate Jacarandas grow much bigger than pepper trees. However after warning you about the bee hazard with Jacarandas it's best I warn you that the insignificant flowers of the pepper tree are bee magnets! (But at least the foliage can be pruned high so that the bees stay away from pedestrians.) Cheers Anita

[Alisdair]

As Anita says the Koelreuterias do make lovely trees from mediterranean-climate gardens. In our Greek garden we have one plant of Koelreuteria paniculata raised from seed from another tree we have in South West France, which in turn came from seed from a very old tree in London's Chelsea Physic Garden. It quickly assumes quite an individual character, beginning to look quite gnarled in just a decade or two, and apart from the lovely delicate ferny deciduous foliage and golden flowers the persistent bracts also look quite colourful into the early autumn. These bracts are reddish brown in K. paniculata, rather brighter pinkish brown in the closely related K. bipinnata; a second tree we have in Greece, bought locally, is I think binnata but we've never been there at the time it flowers. Both do well without supplementary water after a year or two to get settled.
These two species are currently under review and may possibly be merged into one by the taxonomists.
Later addition: To see Jorun's photos of the lovely flowers, and of the immature fruits, of Koelreuteria paniculata, click here.

[JTh]

Is there a named variety of non-fruiting Morus Alba to grow for shade and does anyone know a nursery in Greece which stocks it?

I did not see this post earlier, but it is very strange that you are looking for this. I have been visiting almost every nursery (at least quite a few) beween Halkidiki and Thessaloniki, looking for a fruit-bearing Morus, most of them had the non-fruiting ones for shade, but nobody had any of the ones with black fruits, which I was looking for.

[John J]

I wasn't sure where to post this but shade trees seemed as good a choice as any. I was just looking out of our kitchen window at the setting sun on the Melia and Jacaranda. They are both mother trees having provided seeds from which I have grown others. I kept 2 of the offspring of each and, at about 14 years old now, they are all as tall as their parents. What came to mind though was the fact that the mother Jacaranda produces a second, though much reduced, showing of flowers in the autumn and neither of the juveniles does this. Many of the street trees in Limassol, usually much older than mine, do this too. Is this a trait that comes with maturity, I wonder, and if so at what age?

[Alisdair]

That is interesting, John. Our two Jacarandas are about the same age as your young plants, and neither has yet flowered in the autumn - I wonder if I'll live to see that!